James Leishman & Ed Trick On Building Multigenerational Communities Using Inclusive Digital Technology

James (Jimmy) Leishman was born and raised in Cambridge, England, where his parents ran a bustling B&B. With a mix of Scottish and Seychellois heritage, Jimmy has worn many hats throughout his life—from firefighting to advocating for gut health and nutrition, leading outdoor adventures, and even owning a café at Swinburne Uni in Melbourne, Australia.

Known for his boundless energy, Jimmy is currently dedicating his efforts to TeaTime—a project close to his heart aimed at helping the elderly age well and stay socially connected. He is passionate about using technology to improve lives and is on a mission to revolutionize elder care. Jimmy's commitment to TeaTime is driven by his desire to leave a positive impact on the world, especially for his children, Bonnie and Laurelle. When Jimmy sets his mind to something, he sees it through with determination and dedication.

Ed Trick is a proud father of one from Aylesbury, England. Raised by his mother after his father passed away when he was eight, Ed draws inspiration from his grandfather, an esteemed engineer who held the codes to launch a nuclear weapon and was awarded an MBE from the Queen. This prestigious honor sits on Ed's desk, reminding him of his grandfather's achievements and the path he aims to follow.

Ed's career has spanned banking, private equity, fintech, and aged care, with the latter providing him the most excitement and fulfillment. He envisions a future where the aged care sector is transformed with energy and enthusiasm, changing public perceptions to see it as an exciting chapter of life filled with opportunities. Ed is confident that this vision will soon become a reality.

Jimmy and Ed discuss how digital technologies designed with the user at heart can enrich the lives of elderly people by enhancing their ability to meaningfully connect with their families, professional carers and communities.

Highlights from the interview (listen to the podcast for full details)

[Tom Allen] - To start off, can you please share a bit about your backgrounds and what led to your passion for aged care and social enterprise?

[James (Jimmy) Leishman] - For me, I've always been passionate about multi-generational connection and learning from those who have done it before by spending time with the elders in our community.

I've always gravitated to those with lived experience, and during COVID I began seeing an opportunity to help those vulnerable in our community to transition and recover from COVID. Making more of an impact in that aged care space led me to working for an aged care consultancy firm where we helped place individuals going into aged care, and that's where I met Ed. It just felt like that’s where I needed to be and that's where I could make the biggest impact.

[Ed Trick] - It's a strange question, because if you told me five years ago that I would be sitting here talking on a podcast about a new application I'd launched in aged care, I would probably tell you to “get…” followed by some rather juicy expletives! It wouldn't have been a pathway I’d ever have envisioned myself going down, however, having almost met Jimmy by accident, we worked together within aged care.

For an aged care placement consultant, I was managing all the financial and corporate development. I worked with Jimmy to be honest I found inspiration in the impact we were having on the individuals we were ultimately serving. TeaTime came around through an accident; Jimmy and I were in a home at a point in time and a specific incident happened within the home.

Jimmy tells the story amazingly, so I won't steal his thunder, but ultimately the home came to life when we were in this moment. Froom then on it's been full steam ahead, and we haven't looked back since.

[Jimmy Leishman] – The moment was in October of 2022. It was a sunny day, Ed and I were visiting an edge care home called BlueCross Ashby in Templestowe, Melbourne. We got distracted by a lovely resident there, I believe her name was Olive. We sat in the courtyard talking, we were interacting with people in the home.

She told me that her son in law was the number one tennis player in the world, and at that point I thought, “oh my god, it’s Rafael Nadal,” or “she's Djokovic's mother-in-law.” But it turns out, his name is Glenn Busby, and he was the number one tennis player over 60 at the time. A quick Google search showed there he was winning heats in Miami, and she snatched the phone from my hand and began to infinitely scroll through the Google images while becoming more animated. It validated all the stories she had told to people in her home, and as Greg rightfully said, it became a bit of a sporting precinct.

The home came alive, one hour had passed and we realised we had touched on something that while it arguably has the greatest impact it goes unmeasured, and that is family and emotional well-being. Ed had his reasons, I had mine, and we set off down that path to create TeaTime.

Tell us more about TeaTime then, and what it is that you're specifically seeking to address, and how you're doing that, because you talk about connection and family, but what is TeaTime?

[Jimmy Leishman] - To follow on from that story, it's about family. It's about the ability to keep families connected when they can no longer be together due to what is in this case aged care needs. It's reducing the symptoms of isolation and loneliness through meaningful digital connection. It's about showing a grandma her grandson and allowing her to be part of it, even though she's in an aged care home thousands of miles away, she’s with her family.

TeaTime has been built with everyone in mind, and when you include everyone, that's also people who have never picked up a phone in their life. The way TeaTime has been built is that if your mum or your dad is within an aged care setting and doesn't have the ability to use a device themselves, you don't need to worry because the care provider can help facilitate the communication.

From a family perspective, you can be uploading your latest pictures from the week. As an example, yesterday I sent my mum a week's worth of pictures of my daughter. Now, my mum isn't in an aged care facility, but my great aunt is.

I have no way of sharing those pictures with my great aunt, however, if the care provider in the UK where my great aunt is using TeaTime, I would know that the same pictures I shared with my mum who's using WhatsApp would then be opened by the carer through our portal and ultimately shared with my great aunt, who's in her chair, hasn't moved out of her apartment for five years, and can't use technology. TeaTime is built for everybody, and anyone can use it anywhere whether they can use a device or not.

You are currently AMP Foundation Tomorrow Makers, which is meaning you're receiving support to help develop and grow TeaTime. What have been your reflections and learnings from the support to date?

[Jimmy Leishman] - For me the biggest learning has been we're not alone. We're not the only innovators here in Australia looking to create positive social change.

We are part of a growing ecosystem of social entrepreneurs who are looking to create lasting impact and to make the world a better place. The AMP Foundation for Ed and I has certainly given us a peer group where we can rejuvenate and bond. We can encourage one another to keep going, and that is invaluable.

[Ed Trick] - I'd concur with Jimmy; financial backing is great but having a support network with which you can openly discuss things is better. At times there are things you might say externally from a sales perspective, but there is a whole other side of things, issues you can't talk to with your customers, users or the beneficiary of your software.

Having that independent view of someone going through a similar challenge in a completely different perspective or industry helps open your mind, or how you approach and address problems.

What are your observations of this business for good movement in Australia and where do you see opportunities to grow this business for good movement?

[Jimmy Leishman] – The business for good movement and the BFGN communication tool we’ve been using is amazing. The ability for us to easily communicate with our fellow change makers and social entrepreneurs allows us to at any point on our journey to connect, share ideas, exchange resources and contribute to each other's missions that can cross over in some places to help each other amplify our purpose.

The business for good movement is about amplification, unity, and partnership. It allows for all of us to interact a lot more easily, and I've thoroughly enjoyed it. I’ve used BFGN for a while now, even with other social groups as well.

[Ed Trick] - It's an interesting time to be part of any business looking to do more than just generate dollars and cents, because there is a wider global movement and change in how people think about the value of what they buy. What do I mean by that?

PEOPLE ARE BECOMING MORE SOCIALLY CONSCIOUS WITH EVERY SINGLE PURCHASE THEY MAKE. I KNOW THAT NOW WHEN I WALK INTO A SUPERMARKET OR A CLOTHES SHOP, WHERE I MAY HAVE PREVIOUSLY SELECTED THE CHEAPEST OPTION, I NOW THINK ABOUT WHO'S MAKING THIS PRODUCT. WHAT DID THEY MAKE IT FROM? WHERE does THAT PRODUCT COME FROM? WHERE it BEEN SOURCED?

There has been a genuine shift in the way people are buying products and looking at businesses they interact with, and what that means. The business for good movement is only going to get bigger as the drive from consumers continues to change around how their products are sustainably sourced or affect the environment, or how things are affecting people socially.

That's why I think its hugely important social enterprises are supported on that journey, because ultimately there often is a cost to being socially conscious. It’s going to cost more to produce clothes if they're sustainably sourced whereas if you approach a supplier that is perhaps conducting some sort of manufacturing process you wouldn't agree with.

That's still an economical way of buying things, but I do think business for good is going to grow across Australia, whether it's in the business for good format or something else. It will continue to grow globally because of socially conscious consumers.

What advice would you share with other entrepreneurs who are looking to start or grow their own enterprise?

[Ed Trick] - If you can find a co-founder, I think it's so important to grow your tribe early. It's important to grow your capacity early, your energy will be the currency in which you pay to play.

That social entrepreneurial vision you might have is certainly going to require a lot of tenacity and belief in your purpose. If you can find others who share your vision, then you can share the load and together increase your chances of getting to the other side.

[Jimmy Leishman] - In addition, you've got to be excited by what you're doing. If you do not feel an inner passion, excitement or drive for the goal you're looking to achieve, then I would say you are highly likely to never achieve that goal, because there are so many hurdles and obstacles in your way.

These are obstacles you never even would have previously thought existed, so make sure you've got that drive for your purpose and an end goal. You may never arrive at it, but going towards it is what's going to drive you through. Good luck to every budding social entrepreneur out there, we absolutely salute you. It's a long road, but it's got some amazing moments, and I do not regret a thing.

What inspiring projects or initiatives have you come across creating a positive change?

[Jimmy Leishman] - Once you enter this business for good environment, there’s this serendipity where you start to see it and attract it. You start to communicate with others just like you, and once you put that signal into the sky, it attracts other. Ed and I now, whether we're more consciously aware of it or not, are a bit of a beacon.

We attract a lot of amazing initiatives with great purpose, and I've seen so many of late. One I believe in is meetmagic. It's an innovative solution that turns meetings into dollars that can be donated to charitable causes. Carl Gough, who is the founder is an amazing man. I recall that he raised a million dollars for the Starlight Children Foundation.

[Ed Trick] - To turn this question slightly on its head, I would love the listeners to provide some feedback on an initiative we've got rolling here at TeaTime. Since inception, we've almost developed TeaTime as a closed loop. To be involved in the application, you must be a family member of a resident or someone who's involved in the care sector across the globe.

However, isolation and loneliness are global problems, and while you may never solve the problem, you will not go as far to solve the problem if you only allow people to connect with their own families without seeing there's a whole community out there. There are other lonely individuals out there who would love to connect with aged care residents, but they might not be family members, or they might not know them.

Jimmy Leishman and Ed Trick Social Entrepreneurs.jpg

An initiative we've started at TeaTime is completely opening it up to the public, where any single individual could download the app and be matched with an aged care resident across the globe. This is something we're developing user feedback on, and we're talking with a lot of providers asking if this is something we could open to them.

There's a lot of excitement and interest around it, but we would love your listeners feedback on if they would jump on the TeaTime app? Would you match with an aged care resident who was looking to have some conversations, exchange videos/photos, and learn more about you. Would you do that, and would you enjoy doing that? I think it could make a tangible and amazing difference across the nation and globe in later years.

To finish off, what books or resources would you recommend to our audience?

[Jimmy Leishman] - It's got to be Alexander Dumas. He wrote The Count of Monte Cristo. I've always been fascinated by stories of transformation, and Edmond Dantès, our main protagonist here is thrown into Chateau If (a jail) by conspirators.

For many reasons he was betrayed by close friends and allies of his own and thrown into this jail where he meets a very educated man who teaches him how to fight, read, be more calculated, and speak strategically. He also happens to have a map to a lot of treasure, so when the protagonist escapes (I won't tell you how) he finds this treasure. He then goes back to Paris and begins to enact his revenge on those who betrayed him.

Ultimately, he reinvented his stars, reinvented himself, and he makes quite an impact on the world. It might not be a self-help book or a “20 steps to do this” guide, but it made an impact on me.

[Ed Trick] - I'll put my hands up and say I don't read often whatsoever. The last thing I seriously read was probably at school when I was reading Harry Potter books, and I'm not going to sit here and recommend those (even though I'm remembering they were epic). However, I am a bit of a music podcast listener.

This is a left field suggestion, but I'm quite into a podcast called the Monster Cat Silk Showcase, which plays melodic house beats. Anyone looking to get in a zone or to be taken out of wherever they might be at that moment and put into a relaxing space, I highly recommend this.

Secondly, while we're here, England have just gone through to the final of the Euro 2024 Championships, and I've been listening to the Rest Is Football Podcast, so if anyone's got any love for soccer or football, get onto those as well.